Fact: Most atheists don't believe there is no God, only that they've never seen any evidence of a God. At one point, the debate moved to the question of whether man can have meaning in life apart from God. For the Christian it simply means that all power and authority are Gods. What is an atheist? Hello all, I used to be an Atheist a long time ago, now I'm a Christian. You must signup or login to view or post comments on this article. In the 21st century, the cowardice associated with atheism has become so obvious that it is making newspaper headlines. And yes, He could just as easily will to lie. It's not explicitly labeled Christian vs Atheist, but of course it actually was. If everyone reading Pravmir could donate 5 euros a month, Discussion flow chart for an atheist debating a Christian. A place to debate the existence of God, the spirit realm, who Jesus was, if Christianity is the one true religion, whether atheism, deism, or theism is the most logical position, or any topic. My favorite is the Intelligence 2 debate on whether death is final. For me, this is one of the most legitimate arguments against the existence of a good God. Even if there was a God, continued the outspoken atheist, it still wouldn't prove that this entity cared about man or answered prayers. The Chief Rabbi of the United Hebrew Congregations of the Commonwealth in the U.K. has called out atheist professor Richard Dawkins for his best-selling book The God Delusion, accusing the biologist of using anti-Semitic rhetoric and calling him a "Christian atheist.". 3. Functionality is temporarily unavailable. There is no arguing the fact that history is full of similar stories found in the Bible, and I wont take the time to recount them here. An estimated 4,000 people packed the university's gym to watch the event while an additional 6,000 from around 120 church sites from another thirty states and four countries watched a live feed of the debate. We will not discover anything that harms Christian theism by thinking logically and by looking at the evidence. Most of the 'regulars' are atheists/agnostics and we have formed a tightnit community.we support one another and challenge both Christians and Muslims (as well as people of other religions) who come into our room. When confronted with the charge that there is no evidence for God the Christian often does not know where to start with a rebuttal. The gospel doesnt make sense: God was mad at mankind because of sin so he decided to torture and kill his own Son so that he could appease his own pathological anger. Christians (at least Orthodox Christians) view Gods ontology as subject to His perfect free-will. That increase alone is larger than the entire share of atheists in 2019. Here lives with his wife and two boys in Mt. Pastoral Advice, The Importance of Patiently Letting Down Our Nets in Obedience, Preparing the Way of the Lord in our Own Lives, Atheist Cold-Case Investigator Tried Disprove Christs Resurrection, Gets Converted Instead, Standing on the Lasting Platform of Faith, I Used to Laugh at the Church and Now I am Restoring a Temple an Unusual Story of an Artist, God Is Not a Slave to our Timetables: Lesson from Judith, Why was Cains Offering Rejected? Throughout the history of the Church there have been many people like this who have sat differently to the central creedal claims, but in . Nah my friend ur partly right, logic is how we reason, how we make sense of things, logos is a greek word which means " word uttered by a living voice, embodies a conception or idea" as in jesus, when he came forth from the father! "I thought it was a great showing for belief in God, the Christian intellectual tradition, and Biola University as a global center for Christian thought," said debate host Craig Hazen, director of the M.A. This year's debate between Jordan Peterson and Slavoj iek was marketed as one of the greatest intellectual debates of the century. This is more "science vs wilful ignorance" and Nye does a pretty good job of showing why being wilfully ignorant is a bad idea. To be fair, the same goes with most Christian apologists. This criticism is voice in many different ways. But nothing-in-particulars are a different story. program in . I will not delete any comments, no matter how uncivil or juvenile they become, because, for me, it is an important part of the article. If one means, that which has come into existence, then surely God does not exist because God never came into existence. Thanks for reading. To be a Jewish believer is to have Judaism permeate ones thinking and believing and interaction with the world. ok ill give u dat I just checked the meaning!! It is a question of faith, which is the basis or foundation for Christians or Christianity , and is one, major stumbling block for atheists, who lack said faith or belief in their Creator and/or cling to disbelief or lack "proof" or "evidence" of Him. About Community. . ok, how du know ur reasoning is valid?? If God created the universe, who created God? Why Christianity is false | Atheist Christian DebateGhalib Kamal debates with a Christian about the lies in the bible. Thou Shalt Give Thy Post a Useful and Descriptive Title. held at Biola University, an evangelical Christian university in Southern California, was the second time in two weeks that the two figures sparred over the topic. You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world. The responses (if there are any) will demonstrate the current state of atheist vs. Christian banter. At one time I would waste considerable time attempting to debate atheists and finally realized it was a waste of time. The argument takes as its presupposition that good and evil are real; that there is an ultimate standard of good and evil that supersedes mere fanciful ideas about what is good and evil at a given time in our ethical evolution, as it were. How can one prove civilization by merely selecting a piece here and a piece there as sufficient proofs rather than having an experience of civilization as a whole? If suffering and death exist it seems to suggest one of two things: (1) either God is love, but He is not all-powerful and cannot stop suffering and death, or (2) God is all-powerful, but He does not care for us. Created/Updated: April 2, 2020. "I guess I don't believe in God either, at least not in any concrete way," Mason said pensively during her allotted 15-minute response time. Dr. Graham Oppy of Monash University is one such formidable philosophical atheist. To be fair, the same goes with most Christian apologists. A cup of coffee? A rationale is a tool of the intellect. Please make sure all fields are filled out. As a Christian, on this forum, I am told that anyone that calls themselves a Christian has the right to do so. Instead, one finds myths created intentionally for children, for point making, or for whatever. etc, ad infinitum. But is this the state of affairs with the majority of the Jewish people, whether in America, Europe, Israel, or wherever? It is found in many variations but the concept is fairly consistent and goes something like this: Science has brought us to a point where we no longer need mythology to understand the world, and any questions which remain will eventually be answered through future scientific breakthroughs. An Islam Christian Debate: Part 1. evangelist | 3 Views. Blair Scott, communications director for American Atheists, and Kyle Butt, a Christian apologist who works for the Apologetics Press, went head-to-head last week during a debate on the existence of the Judeo-Christian God at the University of North Alabama in Florence. The argument is a bit involved, so for times sakes Ill just have to state it and leave it there. Sita Ram Goel (16 October 1921 - 3 December 2003) was an Indian historian, religious and political activist, writer, and publisher in the late twentieth century. Evolution has answered the question of where we came from. The Gospel Coalition supports the church by providing resources that are trusted and timely, winsome and wise, and centered on the gospel of Jesus Christ. A court of law provides innumerable examples of how two parties can possess the same collection of data, the same power of logic and reasoning, yet argue for completely different interpretations of the data. The old saying is true: the facts do not determine the argument, the argument determines the facts. What does it all even mean, anyway?". What does one mean by existence? Also in terms of civility I do think civility forces people to think. He is the author of The Nones: Where They Came From, Who They Are, And Where They Are Going (Fortress Press, 2021). Starting with the idea of evidence, what exactly does one mean by evidence? But they don't have to be. One additional note: another reason I do not enter into the atheist-Christian debate world much anymore is because of the sheer discourtesy that both sides tend to show the other. If you want to see a good debate, watch Ken Ham VS Bill Nye. Raising Orthodox Children to Orthodox Adulthood, The Daily Website on How to be an Orthodox Christian Today, Should People Limit Marital Relations in Lent? We are non-political group of all religions and non-religious people. i have had several debates with some kids at my school who have made the decision to become atheists. At one point, tickets were being scalped for over $1,500 a seat. Others are incredibly philosophical, showing a strong grasp of epistemology and teleology. 10. During the past twenty years, while many apologists and philosophers have been debating (mostly among themselves) whether it is theologically acceptable or philosophically credible to argue for the existence of God, William Lane Craig has been on the road debating the . If you're here to ask a question, put that question in the title. Avoiding overly esoteric arguments, they directly address issues such as religious experience, the Bible . Craig, a Biola professor and one of the world's leading philosophers of religion, claimed in opening remarks that there is no good argument that atheism is true but that there are good arguments that theism is true. One of the largest religious message boards on the social-media website Reddit is simply called "Debate an Atheist.". Logic comes from the word "logos" which means "word". ). 6. Jessica Airey February 15, 2013. Ham always refers to the bible, while Nye refers to science. "Emancipate yourself from the idea of a celestial dictatorship and you've taken the first step toward becoming free," Hitchens told the crowd. Confessions of a Christian Atheist is a blog and podcast created by Todd Connor, Author of "Liz Here Now". The Bible teaches that Jesus is unique. Science is fantastic if you want to know what gauge wire is compatible with a 20 amp electric charge, how agriculture works, what causes disease and how to cure it, and a million other things. Just 38 percent say that religion has no importance in their lives, and only a quarter say that it is not too important.. That leaves about 18 percent who attend yearly or more, which is six times the rate of atheists and three times the rate of agnostics. Debating Christianity and Religion Civil and engaging debate on Christianity and religious issues. Affiliate disclosure: As an Amazon Associate, we may earn commissions from qualifying purchases on Amazon.com. r/DebateAnAtheist is dedicated to discovering what is true, real, and useful by using debate to ascertain . But this is hardly sufficient evidence in the court of atheist opinion, a court which presupposes that only what can be apprehended by the senses rightly qualifies as evidence. 1) There's no good evidence that atheism is true. For example, 5 euros a month is it a lot or little? Hitchens, part of the movement of "new atheists" or "militant atheists" who seek to eliminate religion, said he didn't have to prove God didn't exist. Just over three-fourths of agnostics say that religion is not at all important., Nothing-in-particulars look like theyre operating in an entirely different world than other types of nones. God is not all-powerful if there is something He cannot do. It doesn't really matter due to the fact that "the word" is not the definition or meaning. Debate: Former atheist neurosurgeon vs. former Christian activist. 01:07:28. Those who use this argument against Christianity simply fail to grasp what . Because He wills it. Hosted by Justin Brierley, e ach season consists of six special shows with conversations and debate exploring science, faith, philosophy and what it means to be human. On December 8, 2002, atheist Michael Newdow and Christian Cliffe Knechtle participated in "The Great Debate: Atheism vs. Christianity." The debate was held at Rolling Hills Christian Church in Sacramento, California and was broadcast live via satellite to around 1,500 churches and other Christian organizations, sponsored by Church . Atheists and Christians Debate Truth And Belief | Middle Ground. Ultimately one has to agree that God will decide that question and many who think they are will be found not to be. SO it depends on what you believe more, science or the bible. They only sought an argument for the sake of an argument, therefore Jesus said "Do not give dogs what is holy, and do not . The "image" is not what it represents, but the representation. 3:15). Christian's only believe in Christianity because they were born in a Christian culture. That might sound crazy. An argument based on strict logical word games can render the idea all-powerful, or omnipotent self-defeating. Christian apologist William Lane Craig and renowned atheist Christopher Hitchens went head-to-head in a debate over the existence of God Saturday night as thousands intently listened on at the sold-out event and via live feeds. History is full of mother-child messiah cults, trinity godheads, and the like. I fort it came from logic, ok where does ur logic come from? Christianity . Again, we're dealing with our reasoning or intellectual capacities which reflect reality. During the rebuttal session, Craig took issue with what he felt was Hitchens' failure to provide reasons for how atheists can decide what is moral or immoral. Maybe. :) Others are incredibly philosophical, showing a strong grasp of epistemology and teleology. "It went good, Craig offered arguments, whereas Hitchens didn't," Stan Markowski, a Biola senior, commented, according to the Daily Titan, the student newspaper of California State University, Fullerton. Among the nones, theres a clear divergence between atheists, agnostics, and nothing-in-particulars. See also: Rebuttals to atheist arguments and Responding to atheists and Atheism debates The atheist Sam Harris quipped about William Lane . There is no evidence for Gods existence. A very active subreddit to debate and pose arguments to atheists. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where . What can I do to receive the Holy Spirit? Atheist; Community; Great Debate; 53-Small Town Atheist. While debating an atheist might be an intellectually stimulating exercise, theres little evidence that atheists are receptive to changing their views of God. The first article on Noah's Flood (in the non-believers section) has been published on the site. A thousand U2 cover bands is not evidence that U2 is a myth. The debate was sponsored by the Biola Student Association as well as the Christian Apologetics department at Biola University. Ah, but that doesnt address the fact that some of these stories were told before the Biblical accounts. Paperback. most of their arguments consist of science disproving the bible. Recall that nothing-in-particulars make up more than 20 percent of the current adult population, which means the share of this group that indicates religion is at least somewhat important is larger than the share of all the atheists or agnostics in the United States. Fernandes presents his cumulative case for the existence of God in support of his thesis that "it is more reasonable to be a theist than it is to be an atheist.". The words of Hebrews 2:18 apply to Jesus and Jesus alone. Why mobile abortion clinics are a terrible idea, Election season: A most dangerous time of spiritual warfare, Evangelical Publishers Group to Open Inaugural Christian Book Expo, Preachers, Philosopher Square Off in ABC Debate on Satan. They are not closed off to religion, and are much more likely to return to a Christian tradition than either atheists or agnostics are. It shouldnt come as a surprise that a huge share of atheists never step foot inside a church. We have a Pal Talk chat room dedicated to religious debate which is open 24/7. Following the debate, attendants had the opportunity to purchase books from both authors during a book signing. The God of the Bible is evil. To many's disappointment, but probably for the best, the event went off without the anticipated drama. We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless! Just as companies perform market research to determine how to create products and advertise them to the public, churches would do well to understand the groups they are trying to reach. Atheists rely on science to explain the existence of life and the cosmos. We have a social contract, and people who violate that contract and are caught, suffer the consequences. He earned both an MA and PhD in political science from Southern Illinois University in Carbondale. So, without entering into the most pathetic debate of the ages, bereft of all intellectual profundity, Ill only comment on the underlining idea that science has put Christianity out of the answer business. "We've heard attacks upon religion, Christianity impugned, God impugned, Mother Teresa impugned, but we haven't heard any arguments that God does not exist," said Craig. 7. In 2008, they were 14.4 percent of the sample; by 2019, they had jumped to 21.5 percent, an increase of more than seven percentage points. Nearly everything the Christian lays eyes on is proof of Gods existence because he sees the handiwork of God all around him in creation. 1 However, as they say, 'what's good for the goose is good for the gander', so each debater must adhere to the same rules if it is to be fair (see step C). It was the epicenter of innovation and philosophical giants. The Truth About Martin Luther, the Ninety-Five Theses, and the Castle Church Door. 2. It makes sense that 95 percent of atheists say that religion is not at all important to their lives. If one were to say that there is no such thing as the truth, then they have just contradicted themselves by making a truth claim. actuallyserious650 8 yr. ago. Teacher: "And that's the proof that the Earth is 6,000 years old." Me (internally): "Does not compute." Me: "But don't fossils prove that the Ear. A counterfeit coin does not prove the non-existence of the authentic coin, it proves the exact opposite. The virgin birth of Christ was profound and of paramount concern to the ancients precisely because they understood that conception was impossible without intercourse. The following passage is how Fr. There is so much good content of this type on the Internet, but it's easy to forget it when you're either in, or about to enter, a debate. It is our deepest belief that preaching Christ for money is wrong. The perennial debate between believers and non-believers has often focused upon the existence of the universe. 8. Hitchens responded by saying there is no proof that people closer to a supernatural being act better than people who are not. "At least, I don't think I do. That wouldn't make sense. The evolutionist has no commentary whatsoever on the existence of God, and the creationist usually suffers from profound confusion in their understanding of the first few chapters of Genesis. These debates often grow heated and wind up fruitless. This struggle is applauded in the Orthodox Church. I need your help, if you wouldn't mind.. I'm working on a website about the Bible for believers and non-believers. There are a couple of problems with this line. Post your best arguments for the supernatural, discuss why your faith is true, and tell us how your reasoning led you to a belief in the supernatural. Nothing-in-particulars seem like an eager and accessible audience. [20] Geoffrey Burgon (1941-2010): British composer notable for his television and film themes. I like the topic; it was very well moderated; and it has Steve Novella and Sean Carroll. Just 57 percent report no church attendance, and another quarter indicate that they seldom attend services. Debate with Frank R. Zindler, an Atheist, and John P. Koster, a Christian, aired on a Detroit Christian radio program. What is tricky for the atheist in these sorts of debates is to steer clear of words loaded with religious overtones. But this fact should not be surprising in the least, indeed if history had no similar stories it would be reason for concern. If you're here to debate a conjecture, put the subject of debate in the title. It was in atheist chat-rooms and blogs that I first cut my teeth in theology many years ago. Vernon, Illinois, where he is pastor of First Baptist Church. can u answer my original question. SHERWOOD, OR - Local progressive believer Danielle Mason reportedly attempted to debate atheist Lucas Peterson on the various ideas including the existence of God at a local coffee shop Sunday evening, but ended up agreeing with him on every point. Let me say upfront that there is perhaps no other subject that bores me more than evolution vs. creationism debates. God cannot lie, therefore God is not all-powerful. They claim that they can have morality without God and that the concept of a deity is . Lewis said on a similar matter: There is no sense in talking of becoming better if better means simply what we are becomingit is like congratulating yourself on reaching your destination and defining destination as the place you have reached.. Instead, he is more in a position to wrestle with the idea that God is good. I would wager that if a common person of today found himself in a philosophical debate with a common person of first century Alexandria, the moderner would be utterly humiliated in the exchange. The Importance of Patiently Letting Down. The two men participated in a discussion about Dawkins' book on the BBC program "Re:Think," where Lord Jonathan Sacks accused . Since those days I have not heard anything new from atheists. He could just as easily will to not exist. This argument is appealing because it pretends to wholly dismiss peoples reasoning capabilities based on their environmental influences in childhood. Let's look then at my first basic contention: there's no good evidence that atheism is true. Indeed, being born in a Jewish or Christian centric home today is more often a precursor that the child will grow up to abandon the faith of his or her family.